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 Post subject: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2000 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
now, before anyone gets carried away making suggestions, let me just say that we didn't resolve how to do this process, after some confusion and understandable complaints last month.<P>i am starting this thread just to air my thoughts, then stuart and azlan can decide how to do the selection process this time.<P>last month i mentioned that our selection criteria aren't written down anywhere, but i know what mine are. so i'm going to put them down here, as a starting point for whatever happens next. note: these are only MY criteria, for photos i select - they are not the site's criteria (at least not at this point, they're not).<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><U>PHOTO SELECTION CRITERIA</U><P>1. excellent professional quality photograph, in terms of focus, composition, reproduction, etc. - because the quality of the photo reflects on the quality of our overall site - 'first impressions' and all that!<P>2. 'welcoming' image - to encourage, not disvcourage visitors<P>3. different genre than last month's (i.e. if ballet last month, not ballet this month)<P>4. different gender than last month (hopefully i don't need to explain that one!)<P>5. different colouring than last month's (if last month was predominantly red, this month's ought not to be)<P>6. permission needs to be easily obtainable OR the picture in the public domain OR to be currently in use as part of a promotion, in such a way as to lead to a fair conclusion that it may be used to assist that dancer's/company's publicity campaign.<P>7. credits of both subject and photographer need to be readily available<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>#1 & 2 are the most important things to me.<P>as stuart said last time around, i think, any picture chosen should accurately reflect the values of the site to a complete newcomer, and encourage them to continue through the site, not put them off!<P>#3,4 & 5 are only 'ideals' not 'musts'. we need to avoid a succession of one type of photograph, which might innappropriately suggest to newcomers that we only deal with that one genre of dance, for example.<P>now i can hear you all groaning: Image yes, i know my criteria make it hard. i'm like that, i'm afraid! i make everything hard for myself! Image<P>OK guys - stuart, azlan - you take it from here.....

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2000 1:50 am 
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Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 19975
Location: London, England; Tallinn, Estonia
I have to say that the next couple of weeks are going to be exceptionally busy for me and for others as well. In addition, I've grown rather fond of 'Mythologies'. Can I suggest that we leave it up for amother [I've left this mis-spelling 'cos I like the alliteration] month, especially as it didn't make it for the start of September.<P>Then we can sort out the selection procedures (nominations, short-listing, voting or whatever) for the future.<P>grace's criteria for individual images, structured impeccably above, is excellent.<P><p>[This message has been edited by Stuart Sweeney (edited September 15, 2000).]


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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2000 9:24 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 214
Location: France
couldn't you make your own pictures for the mainpage, or just modify an existing pictures with some beautiful effects? that's quiet easy. <BR>I don't think you need a perfect professional photo, the best is a picture which is nice to see. Why being so exacting (?)? <BR>(i'm not criticizing of course, just giving an advice Image )<P>And well, if you're interested, there are tons of pictures on this site: <A HREF="http://www.zing.com/album/pictures.html?id=4294763405&p=4293452336" TARGET=_blank>http://www.zing.com/album/pictures.html?id=4294763405&p=4293452336</A> <P>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2000 6:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
ah yes! zing is quite fun, isn't it?!?<P>thanks paquita - & the answer, i suppose is that *I* personally tend to be rather 'exacting', to use your word, at EVERYTHING! Image Image Image<P>one problem with the zing photos is that they are not actually cleared in copyright terms. dee avila, who runs that site, is aware of that...<P>for a while i played a game helping her to identify dancers...i got about 3/4 of the way through her sheets, letting her know all of what i recognised - many are not labelled and some are wrongly labelled - but got distracted after that - it was fun while it lasted! she's open to any help, if any of you out there can identify for her...<BR>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2000 10:56 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2000 11:01 pm
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Location: France
yeah I know that there is some problems with the copyright, when I came on this homepage, I found some pictures of ME! I was so angry!!! And i'm still angry, because someone took my pictures on my homepage without any authorization, but maybe it's not her...<P><BR>and grace, I use the word "exacting" but I was not sure of the meaning, hope you understand if the meaning is not the right Image Image Image<BR> <BR>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2000 11:34 pm 
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Location: Australia
'exacting' is indeed a VERY appropriate word, paquita! Image<P>do you mean that there are some photos of you, taken off your own homepage, and now up at the zing site? if so, you are quite right in assuming that other people may have provided them - dee explained to me that this is why she doesn't know who some of them are, because they were supplied by other people. she seems like a very nice caring person, paquita, and i am quite sure she would remove any photos of yours mmediately, if that's what you want, if you just tell her..her email is cicidia@yahoo.com Image<P>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2000 12:56 am 
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Location: France
i've already written to her... She said that as I'm not the photographer, but the dancer, I don't have any rights on these pictures... So I guess my pictures are still available to everyone! I hate that...but what can I do? nothing<P> Image<P>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2000 4:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
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Location: Australia
oh dear - that's NOT the response i would have expected. and i don't like that, at all......if it was me, i'd very definitely be hopping mad - i might drop her a line.....

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2000 9:38 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 19975
Location: London, England; Tallinn, Estonia
Yes do grace. Given all your work for her she may do as you ask. If not, we'll know not to work with her again.


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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2000 8:59 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
dear paquita, i DID send this CD page to dee avila, whose collection is featured at the zing site.<P>she makes one valid point which is that you need to prove they ARE photos of you. i imagine this would be easy enough, to just supply the link to your homepage, where they were taken from?<P>however, to complicate matters, she also tells me that one is unable to edit the pages within the zing format, so that once complete pages are up there, they cannot be changed (i think i have understood that correctly)....<P>dee says that she recieved 2 anonymous letters from a 'MissS@hotmail' (which may be you?) & that she responded that she would like to keep the photos, because they are quite nice. and that she explained about the editing problem....and offered to credit the photos instead of removing them. she said that as she did not get any response to that request, she added the anonymous email address to the photos instead.<P>sounds like she feels very frustrated because she only wanted something lovely to be seen, however i sympathise with YOU, paquita, and would be most unhappy - and angry - if they were photos of me, and a single polite request didn't solve the problem.<P>i wrote her back this:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>dear dee, i sympathise.<P>i'm sure paquita would be completely unaware of any technical difficulties involved. i will pass this on to her.<P>i realise the copyright is with the photographer, and it DID occur to me, that she would need to be able to prove they were hers, otherwise, anyone could tell you to remove any picture.....<P>i do however believe that we have a responsibility not to use personal images of other people without their permission - particularly on the internet with its pervasive and anonymous culture....<P>also people have different attitudes and values: what YOU perceive as a compliment to her, perhaps, may be seen by the subject as an intrusion on their privacy...i can see both points of view, but i also know that, if it was me, i would be livid!<P>so i understand her frustration: you have something which she understandably regards as 'hers' (her image), she doesn't know you, and never gave it to you, so quite rightly feels that someone (not you) has stolen it (common on the internet, but that doesn't make it 'right'). you won't 'give it back', so she feels thwarted - and without any recourse. no wonder she feels angry.<P>and all the while you intended only to do something beautiful.<P>frustrating all round.....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2000 11:42 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 214
Location: France
I can swear you that it was me on the pictures, they are published on my own homepage so...oh and I want you to know, I've never NEVER witten any anonymous mail to anyone! <BR> <A HREF="http://membres.tripod.fr/misss/index-4.html" TARGET=_blank>http://membres.tripod.fr/misss/index-4.html</A> <BR>here are the pictures.<P><BR>bye! <P><p>[This message has been edited by grace (edited October 06, 2000).]

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2000 11:44 am 
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Location: France
oh and Grace, a big thank you, you're so great Image

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 Post subject: Re: October Front Page Photo
PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2000 3:17 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
paquita, i believe you, of course. it's dee who needs to be sure the pictures are yours - otherwise anyone could contact her, and say 'that's me - please remove it' - do you see?<P>i went to have a look again at her site earlier - but it was taking a long time to load, as photos often do, so i gave up...but i'd love to see YOUR photos, so i will try again....<P>meanwhile, it's very nice to feel appreciated. we like having you around, too! Image

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