public forum
home forum magazine gallery links about faq courtesy
It is currently Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:18 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 247 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 ... 17  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 3:27 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2002 11:01 pm
Posts: 36
Congratulations on your debut, Prodanseur! What a start! You registered on 31st of March in order to criticise a dancer in the role, which he has not danced for several months. Why are your feelings so strong?

Thank you, Stuart, for maintaining the courtesy rule.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:20 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 11
Well, because I just registered, does not mean that I don't read the forum. I felt so strongly about Nikolai because he was built up for us. I don't know if those in the Bay Area saw Joan Boada perform Bayadere a number of years ago, but if there was any example of what it should look like, he provided it.

I think another part of my dislike for his dancing(based on what I saw), is that there seems to be a trend developing into classical ballet where it is more preferable to have pretty feet than commanding artistry(most especially in the states). Considering we had problems with the Grigorovich version of Swan Lake in general, he merely contributed to our dissapointment.
It is hard to judge a dancer based on one performance, and tours can be extremely rough. But I have seen videos of Nikolai, like Moscow Competition, and he seemed the same in those videos as well.

In response to Nikolai not dancing the role in months: I am sure Swan Lake is not new to him. Like most men from the Bolshoi school Sigfreid's varition and many others, are burned into the memory. And as a person who has competed in competitions, these variations are excerised beyond mercy. With that understanding, it was hard for us to forgive the performance. Ofcourse, there is a certain amount of envy that comes into play, but, I am still in the process of trying to excercise those particular demons.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:20 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 11
Quick question.

What is the curtesy edit for?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:28 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2002 11:01 pm
Posts: 537
Location: New Orleans, LA
The courtesy edit exists because everyone from those in the audience to those who work to entertain those in the audience both on and behind the stage deserves respect for what they do and basic decency. In that respect, it is hard to imagine that anyone would object.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:36 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 19975
Location: London, England; Tallinn, Estonia
Quick response [VS] - I've e-mailed you twice on your registered e-mail address about your post and our courtesy rule.

If you haven't already read these, I hope you'll see that parts of your post breached these guidelines:

http://forum.criticaldance.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000216

Criticising dancers is fine and some will agree and others disagree. But the way it is expressed is crucial on CriticalDance. If you need further clarification by all means e-mail me on:

stuart@criticaldance.com


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 9:42 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2001 11:01 pm
Posts: 1639
Location: London UK
Quote:
Originally posted by [VS]ProDansuer:
In response to Nikolai not dancing the role in months: I am sure Swan Lake is not new to him. Like most men from the Bolshoi school Sigfreid's varition and many others, are burned into the memory. And as a person who has competed in competitions, these variations are excerised beyond mercy. With that understanding, it was hard for us to forgive the performance. Ofcourse, there is a certain amount of envy that comes into play, but, I am still in the process of trying to excercise those particular demons.
Actually the role of Siegfried in Swan Lake IS relatively new to him. Until very recently the Bolshoi danced a version of Swan Lake by Vasiliev in which the leading role was not Odette/Odile but the father of the prince, a role created for Tsiskaridze. This was dropped a couple of years ago and the more familiar Grigorovitch version (a model of conventionality by comparison) made a reappearance, with Tsiskaridze in the role of Rothbart. As far as I'm aware he danced the role of Siegfried for the first time last year and has given few performances since, a handful at most. When he danced the role in the US last year, he was reviewed by Criticaldance's mehunt (in my opinion the best critic on the web) although she had some reservations about him in the role I think her comments may interest you. Here is the link http://forum.criticaldance.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=001753;p=4


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 9:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2002 11:01 pm
Posts: 36
When writing about a dancer's career, one should check the facts. It is true, "Swan Lake" is not new for Tsiskaridze: he always used to dance Rothbart in both Grigorovich and Vassilyev's productions, and as
Rothbart he was incomparable. He danced Ziegfrid for the first time at 27, did not dance it in competitions, and it is not one of his favourite roles.

"Like most men from the Bolshoi school Sigfreid's varition and many others, are burned into the memory." That's not true. There are some other Bolshoi principals who never danced Ziegfrid in performances or competitions.

However, there is a misunderstanding. It was not "Nikolai not dancing the role in months". It is ProDanseur who has not sent his posting for months.

Everyone has his/her preferences. However, it will be illogical for someone who has not seen Nikolai in "La Bayadere" to advise Ileana, who admired him in this role, that another dancer was better. In order to
judge a dancer in "La Bayadere" one has to see him in this ballet.

There is no need to justify Tsiskaridze as a first-rank dancer. He proved it long time ago. And he possesses both "pretty feet and commanding artistry". Where "a certain amount of envy that comes into play" is concerned, as the Member frankly admits, well, this is - sadly - human.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 10:00 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2001 11:01 pm
Posts: 3785
Location: Paris, FRANCE
Thank you for the link, Cassandra ! really very interesting.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 11:54 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2002 11:01 pm
Posts: 25
Location: Moscow, Russia
In the April issue of the DANCE EUROPE you can find an interview of Nikolai Tsiskaridze by Basheva.

Dance Europe Table of Contents - No. 62 - April 2003


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2003 10:29 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 11
I apologize for the critique. While I mean no disrespect to Nikolai or any of the people who enjoy his dancing, I was merely attempting to add another opinion to the thread. But this, I am sure is understood.

I was unable to find Mehunt's review from the link provided, but Mehunt in person is a very interesting person to engage discussion with, as we have done so on many an occasion.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 5:11 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 186
Location: Great Britain
"... he was built up for us".
Who are the builders? The answer is simple: the public who is in love with him. Also the most experienced and discerning ballet critics (I stress the word 'discerning'): the doyen of the British critics Clement Crisp, the most fearsome of the French critics Rene Sirvin, the editor of the "Dancing Times", etc. Please read the latest block in this 'building':
Dancing Times, April 2003
THE DANCING TIMES GOES TO ST.PETERSBURG
By Mary Clarke
... Solor was Nikolai Tsiskaridze, glamour boy from the Bolshoi and idol of the St Petersburg ballet fans — understandably so! In this version, the Gamzatti/Solor pas de deux comes in the final act and this develops into the pas de trois in which the betrothed couple are intersected, all the time, by the ghost of Nikiya. The ballerinas made subtle distinction between the human and the vision, with Solor hopelessly trapped between them. Tsiskaridze, from Georgia, is not only a magnificent dancer, at the age of 30 at the very height of his power, but possessor of a panther-like softness and strength and the charisma to make any improbable or exotic character plausible. (The photograph of him as the Golden Slave in Schéhérazade in the souvenir programme tells you all.)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 9:30 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 12:01 am
Posts: 1451
Location: San Francisco, CA
I'm a little late (again) but I have to say, I'm enjoying reading about Nikolai Tsiskaridze again and thinking how interesting that he excites such discussion.

First, welcome VS! You mentioned that I know you, so of course I'd love it if you'd drop me a line and let me know how you're doing.

I've met a fair number of people who don't care for Tsiskaridze, so you're not alone. On the one hand I can see why, but on the other, I do feel that Tsiskaridze tends to be judged overly harshly -- and interestingly, it is often other male dancers who are the harshest.

Regardless of what anyone thinks of his technique or style, the truth is that the level that Tsiskaridze (Why do I have the unnerving feeling that I keep misspelling his name?) has risen to at a very young age, is that of international star. From the interviews I've read from him, I believe he understands that this means he is under extra scrutiny and that there is enormous pressure on him to "produce." BUT, I feel that before we criticize his performances too closely, we do have to remember that he is still young (relatively speaking for a principal), he will have to develop his future roles and dramatic approaches under the glare of the spotlight. He is in a company which, as far as I can see has undergone a great deal of stress and flux, and who knows what kind of teaching and coaching has been available to him to help him develop strength and control.

VS, I agree with you that there are a great many dancers out there these days with what Otis Stuart once called "a great hoof" (meaning pretty feet) and fewer with stage presence and command. I'm glad, though, that there are people out there that still look for the artistry. If we see too many principals out there with more hoof and less presence, though, is it really entirely their fault, or is it the lack of coaching and perhaps poor decisions by the artistic staff?

And not that I would necessarily put Tsiskaridze in the category of all hoof, and no presence. As I said in my review, I'd really like to see him in something else. (BTW, the review is about halfway down the page in the link that Cassandra provided, or you can read it on my own site here)I understand that his Slave in Scheherezade is really terrific.

Thanks so much for your compliment, Cassandra, :) I really appreciate that.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2003 12:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Mar 20, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 3000
Location: San Francisco
VS, although I can’t say I didn’t like Tsiskaridze, I wasn’t floored by him. Just to balance things out, I’ve included some comments by another discerning ballet critic — me — posted in CD after I saw Tsiskaridze in Swan Lake last November.

Quote:
Although I think Tsiskaridze is an excellent dancer, I thought, from reading people's comments about him, that I was going to see a phenomenon. I was disappointed. However, I can imagine that he has special qualities that would stand out in more exotic ballets. I think he has an androgynous, feline quality, like Ruzimatov, that would serve him well in ballets such as Scheherezade or Narcisse or any number of non-prince roles.

Very arched feet, hyperextended knees and great flexibility have never been things I've waxed rhapsodic over, so Tsiskaridze's feet and legs and split grands jetes are not so important to me. In fact, sometimes I thought he emphasized his back leg kicking up into a split a bit too much.

The thing is, there are a number of dancers right here in San Francisco (and not just the Russian ones) that I like more than Tsiskaridze.

I'm basing my opinion on only one performance, so I haven't closed my mind about this dancer.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2003 4:00 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 12:01 am
Posts: 11
Ms. Hunt, you remind me all too well why it is dangerous for me to disagree with you. My literary skills pale in comparison with yours. Very nice post.

I do agree that Nikolai(I am fearful for the last name too!) would be excellent in other ballets. I actually did not know who he was until I was at the show and read his name on the program. Maybe it was the self-congragulatory bio that the company had written for the principal dancers. Maybe it was because it was my first time seeing the Bolshoi and I was expecting a lot. I just ended up being extremely dissapointed(that, and it was an $80 ticket!)

Well, I think the issue is probably dead.

p.s. Mrs. Singer, you are quite the detective!

<small>[ 04 April 2003, 05:02 AM: Message edited by: [VS]ProDansuer ]</small>


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Nikolai Tsiskaridze
PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2003 1:19 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2002 12:01 am
Posts: 407
Location: Where little cable cars climb halfway to the stars
That would be Ms. Singer, but thank you.

_________________
"Live your life as an exclamation, not an explanation!" Eddie Izzard


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 247 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 ... 17  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
The messages in this forum are posted by members of the general public and do not reflect the opinions or beliefs of CriticalDance or its staff.
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group