public forum
home forum magazine gallery links about faq courtesy
It is currently Sat Aug 23, 2014 5:23 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 11:48 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 22, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 17498
Location: SF Bay Area
I quoted Christina from another thread:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Remember, the powers at the top aren't familiar with dance, and many probably don't think it's even important enough to make a prior familiarity a requirement.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Then I said, "A dance critic mentioned to me that papers include dance reviews probably more for credibility. She also asked, 'Who reads dance reviews?'"<P>Who indeed reads dance reviews, besides people in the business?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 12:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 13071
Location: San Diego, California, USA
Maybe someone who wants to know which Nutcracker to attend? That's sounds facetious but - here in San Diego there are six Nutcrackers.......


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 12:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 498
Location: neworleans, louisiana
I'm still getting used to this newfangled Internet stuff and didn't realize that I was to follow a new thread (see, I'm learning the lingo). Therefore, my response to "who reads" is on the dance critics thread.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 2:26 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 22, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 17498
Location: SF Bay Area
Christina, I've copied below your post from the other thread:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Christina<BR>Member posted December 20, 2000 13:29 <BR>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Your question/new topic "Who Reads Dance Reviews" brought back memories of my very first newspaper job (back when the friendly clickety click of manual typewriters filled the newsroom), and more particularly, of our weekly critique sessions in which I learned SO MUCH from a country editor/publisher. The rule I learned in my infancy was that we did NOT write about performances after the fact. Simply put, that was not considered news. Now, if a performer suffered a heart attack in the middle of a jete and was treated by the local doc in Lake Wobegon, THAT could be written up. I'm speaking, of course, from the aspect of a smaller newspaper, but even papers much larger than that one would not consider printing a review of a performance. Generally, they'll whittle down the standard news release and print the basic info beforehand. They leave those reviews to the much larger dailies. Even then, and I don't think times have changed that much in this regard, most dailies will confine their reviews to how a LOCAL company performed LOCALLY. The Detroit Free Press, for example, is not likely to write up how ABT fared in the Motor City. Again, if Sally So-and-So from Grosse Pointe gets into the national touring company of Phantom, then there will be a feature on girl makes big, etc. So, getting back to who reads the reviews -- mostly the people associated with the performance and their families, as well as students, some balletomanes, etc., and perhaps the corporate sponsors as well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 2:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 22, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 17498
Location: SF Bay Area
And then Basheva responded:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Basheva<BR>Moderator posted December 20, 2000 13:50 <BR>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Welcome CDTooth and Christina - good to have your expertise onboard - or on board. <BR>Though San Diego is the 6th largest city in the USA, there is very little major dance here, either local or touring. When a major company comes here, what I find lacking in the reviewing is the "eye of comparison". The critic is either overwhelmed by a big name star or company, or is ego tempted to condemn the entity involved. <P>In my opinion, a reviewer needs to either have, at least, a depth of knowledge (years of study) or a width of knowledge (many different companies/dancers which to compare)and, of course, ideally both.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 2:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 22, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 17498
Location: SF Bay Area
To which Christina responded:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Christina<BR>Member posted December 20, 2000 14:11 <BR>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Thanks for the welcome, Basheva. I feel that I already know you somewhat, as we both began posting around the same time on Rosetta's site. You might know me there by the other hat I wear as "Miss Chrissy." No matter how old my students were, they always preferred to call me by the same name they knew me by when they were wee ones -- hence, the nursery school-like name. However, on this site, I think I'd like to achieve some semblance of sophistication -- ahem ...<BR>I must tell you I thought I was pretty well schooled, but I was very surprised to learn that San Diego is 6th largest city in US -- Let's see, NY, LA, Chi-town, Miami (?), Philly. Have I got it? Anyway,it's a pleasure to become formally acquainted. Back to "who reads" -- the most valuable critiques I've read are the ones published in the "trades" -- e.g., Dancemagazine, Dancer. I'm wondering if any of you are familiar with a jewel of a lady named Ann Barzel, whom I met years ago in Chicago (around the time Danny Duell took over Chicago Ballet from Maria Tallchief), who did review locally but contributed quite often to Dancemagazine, and was considered something of an icon in this regard for decades. I don't know if she has passed, but she seemed very dear -- kind of like that lady from the press who has been covering presidential press conferences since at least the time of JFK. Would that all reviewers be of this incredible caliber.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 5:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 13071
Location: San Diego, California, USA
Well, now I recognize you !! Miss Chrissy - well a double welcome to you. That name Ann Barzel sounds very familiar to me - and there is an entire page on her in Google:<P><A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Ann+Barzel%22&btnG=Google+Search" TARGET=_blank>Ann Barzel</A><P>There were many reviews that I enjoyed when I used to subscribe to Dance Magazine, but then many I did not. Sometimes I got the feeling that the reviewer was on a search for multisyllabic verbiage at the expense of clarity. But, that is a very personal view. <BR>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2000 8:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
to answer your question, azlan, to the extent that i can:<P>where i live i think it would be people who want to know whether to go and see a show, OR people who want to compare what is said with their own thoughts about what they saw - often they will learn background or contextual info from the review too, which they find interesting. certainly both of those apply to me as a reader. and iam talking here about newspaper reviews.<P>in my city, there is a newspaper monopoly - only one daily paper, mon to sat! they would definitely cover any major visiting companies as a first priority; and cover local companies as a next priority. (i.e. local coverage 'is good', but anyone coming from somehwere else is regarded as 'more important'.)<P>if the critic is not up to the job in terms of having good knowledge in their artform, believe me the paper hears about it! the local arts community is loud on such an issue if required to be. no-one would last long, who did not possess such attributes here. <P>so the critics are NOT staff journalists, but paid casually/freelance for their work. but they ARE the regular appointed critics for that paper.<P>with the national dance magazine (which i write for) it's a different story completely - like your dance magazine, i suppose. the reviews come out so much after the fact, that no-one is going to read those to decide what to go to - they've most likely already missed it! it is more a case of dance-lovers (mostly subscribers) wanting to be well-informed about dance in australia, so, reading most of the mag regardless of whether they even COULD see the shows (which might be on in another city or state). and also, of following the careers of students, dancers, choreographers, etc.<P><BR>

_________________
<BR>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2000 5:27 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 19975
Location: London, England; Tallinn, Estonia
At a talk recently Anne Sacks of London's Evening Standard told us that dance critics like her are traditionally at the bottom of the heap in terms of the critical hierarchy on a newspaper, perhaps just ahead of the jazz correspondent. She wondered how many people actually read her reviews.<P>Another dance critic in his retirement piece wished that his first love had been drama or opera, as he would have received much more money for his work over his career. I think we would be surprised the number of reviews that are published without payment. <P>Having said that, the dance going public do read reviews and my love affair with dance was kick-started by an enthusiatic review for Momix. With the advent of the Internet a lot of hard-core dance fans are reading a wide range of reviews on sites like this one. <BR><p>[This message has been edited by Stuart Sweeney (edited December 21, 2000).]


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2000 5:45 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 12:01 am
Posts: 3663
Location: The Bronx is up; the Battery's down
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><I>Let's see, NY, LA, Chi-town, Miami (?), Philly. Have I got it?</I><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>No.<P>NY, LA, Chicago, Houston, Detroit, San Diego. . . .<P>Dallas is #10 and San Antonio is either 7, 8, or 9.

_________________
Jeffrey E. Salzberg,
Dance Lighting Design
http://www.jeffsalzberg.com


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2000 5:49 am 
>Another dance critic in his retirement piece wished that his first love had been drama<BR>or opera, as he would have received much more money for his work over his career. I think we would be surprised the number of reviews that are published without payment.<P>That critic is right! <P>But I think most dance critics have a main job, and financially do not rely entirely on the payment for the dance reviews. I myself certainly write on dance due to my passion in this art form instead of for the money.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2000 8:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 26
Location: New York, NY USA
One reason dance critics are at the "bottom of the heap" is that the amount of ink for a section in the paper is directly related to the amount of advertising money coming in for that section. Therefore, film reviewers are numerous and wordy and there are pages of film reviews and features on actors and directors because there might be as many as a dozen pages of film ads, but there’s usually only a quarter-page of dance ads or less, so less space for writing (half-page at best).


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2000 5:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
that's right, cdtooth - the national australian dance magazine, which comes out only every two months, is sized according to the amount of advertising it receives, as i understand it. (i hope jen will correct me if i am wrong) i know i was very surprised when the editor explained this to me - that they can't use worthy articles, even if offered for free, if there isn't enough advertising to 'justify' their presence.<P>i never thought about this from MY point of view, but a friend, who advertises in that mag, pointed out how huge a gap there is, between the amount of money an advertiser PAYS for a certain amount of space, and the amount of money I GET for filling an equivalent amount of space! huge diff! Image

_________________
<BR>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2000 1:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Oct 24, 1999 11:01 pm
Posts: 19975
Location: London, England; Tallinn, Estonia
There may be quite a gap Susan between the rates for writing and advertising, but there are a lot of overheads, apart from writer's fees, to cover before you can issue a magazine.<P>My guess is that the situation of the mag. is about break-even. The publisher of one of the leading UK dance magazines is on record that it is a struggle to keep it viable.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Who Reads Dance Reviews?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 24, 2000 3:58 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
oh, yes - you are right, of course, stuart.<P>btw, when i write for a UK mag like DT, i get paid approximately 5 or 6 times what the australian mag pays. from michael montgomery's comments, i get the impression the same aplies to dance europe's rate, compared to dance australia. so i am being paid a lot less than you might expect - from your own experience with london-based mags - but australia has a much smaller population base than UK or USA, for sales, of course.....<P>the australian dance mag is part of a 'stable' of mags, owned by one small publishing house in sydney. i don't know whether they make any money, or break even, or even conceivably run at a slight loss but get continued for some other reason - or does that not happen in business? i have no idea....but i take your point - it's not a lucrative market, that's for sure! Image<P>i know they would like to publish monthly - and i would like them to - but there isn'y enough advertising to pay for that.

_________________
<BR>


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
The messages in this forum are posted by members of the general public and do not reflect the opinions or beliefs of CriticalDance or its staff.
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group