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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2000 12:35 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 13071
Location: San Diego, California, USA
Mom - that is not rambling at all - but another very interesting perspective. All of us have days when we seem to be "wonderful" and other days - well - that just "are"!!<P>And, it is perfectly correct to ask what are the parameters for judging such young bodies? But, then also on the side of the ballet school trying to train professionals they do have to make choices somehow.<P>I think my problem is I am LIBRA - I can argue both sides......


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2000 1:26 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 498
Location: neworleans, louisiana
Uh oh. I knew we had something peculiar in common, Basheva.


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2000 1:38 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 4753
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada
Maybe if changes were made at the professional level about what kinds of dancers were hired it would give the schools more flexibilty in who they accept into programs? <BR>Btw, since we're sharing, I'm a Sag, which gives me the ability to get both feet in my mouth both literally and figuratively!


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2000 2:47 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 774
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Good point - <BR>"Maybe if changes were made at the professional level about what kinds of dancers were hired it would give the schools more flexibilty in who they accept into programs?"<P>It kind of reminds me of a little bit they used to do on "Sesame Street" - "Which came first, the chicken or the eeeeeeegg. Which came first? The chicken or the eeeeeegg?"<P>There's also the choreographer connection - I've heard people discussing whether or not ballet choreographers are a dying breed and separately that various body types don't fit into people's ideas of currently performed ballets. <P>My ideal would have it so all else being equal, people of a variety of body types could play virtually any role without people saying "So and so isn't really suitable for this role". However, perhaps a more realistic middle ground is for choreographers to create a demand for dancers of different shapes. Basically programming in more parts for not Balanchine-y dancers. Perhaps taking on something like that could be a spark for choreographers and create the growth and creativity some people feel is missing in ballet.<P>It's basically typecasting for choreographers to program in dancers "a big one", "an old one", but though it's frequently said "oh, ballet should be enjoyed by everyone - the young, the old, the female, the male, the thin and the not-so-thin, the tall and the short, the this color skin and the that color skin, the rich and poor and in between (when there is an in between)" - where and what are all these people supposed to dance?<P>It's as though everyone can dance but only some people are allowed to get good. And once they get good there are a lot of doors to bang your head against.<P>And I'm a Cancer, for whatever that's worth. Besides that it's a water sign and I'm surprised I don't swim better.<p>[This message has been edited by Priscilla (edited December 28, 2000).]


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2000 3:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2000 12:01 am
Posts: 4725
Location: Australia
dear priscilla - i DO think you would just LOVE compagnie montalvo-hervieu - i hope you get an opportunity to see them somehow......one day soon. Image

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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:16 am 
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Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 1689
Location: USA
I'm not sure if this article has been posted yet, there have been so many. This one is pro-Keefer.<BR> <A HREF="http://www.sfbg.com/AandE/35/13/stepping.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.sfbg.com/AandE/35/13/stepping.html</A>


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2000 6:30 am 
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Location: San Diego, California, USA
That was a new article to me, Maggie, and thank you for it. <P>This seems to be a true Solomon's dilemma doesn't it?


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 Post subject: Re: Pride and Prejudice at the Barre
PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2000 1:57 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2000 11:01 pm
Posts: 774
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
This (kinda longish) quote from the SFBG article Maggie posted a link to mentions choreographers - as I did in my post above.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Let me go on record with my belief that classical and neoclassical (read: Balanchine) ballet is an outmoded art form that reflects a male-dominated vision of how women should be (emaciated to the point of nonexistence, dainty, happy, or else dead, identical to each other) and should be relegated to the archives. But you can't archive human beings, and there's the rub. Dance uses the human body as its medium, and unlike in theater and the cinema, it's the body pared down. One's physical appearance makes a statement all by itself. Ballet imposes its aesthetic on little girls, whose impressionable minds cannot distinguish between the truth and something passing for the truth. Not everyone can be rail thin, and no one should feel that she should be. Though I agree that the arts should be free of censorship, the question of responsibility arises with the choreographer in a way that it doesn't with painters, writers, sculptors, or composers. The choreographer's medium is another person's body – in the case of the ballet, a child's body. We act in bad faith when we pretend this doesn't matter. As in film and, to a lesser degree, theater, the images of humanity we see touch us and warp us. Young ballet recruits are being warped by adults who should know better and care more.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>And points out one other thing I'd been thinking about - that other art forms like painting and sculpting simply don't have the same connection to individuals' sense of personal beauty. And it's not like it hurts the rock to be chipped at or the paint to be spread, but it does hurt the dancer to dance sometimes.


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